Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism

"Arnie Bernstein" (arniebernstein@hotmail.com) writes:
> You might want to check out Tramp: The Life of Charlie Chaplin by
> Joyce Milton, although it does a hatchet job on his politics and
> personal life. Milton is one of the co-authors of the The Rosenberg
> File, which reveals Julius Rosenberg was guilty--albeit this is also
> written up as a hatchet job.
>
> Arnie Bernstein
> www.arniebernstein.com
> www.myspace.com/arniebernstein

She does turn up a few bits of information, but I don't recall her having
much to say about his activities and associates before the period David
mentions (i.e. after 1921, when he was increasingly surrounded by celebrity
intellectuals, many of whom were leftists). Obviously something was going
on before that, but I'm not at all sure what it was.

My husband thinks his films might be enough to provoke such a quesiton, but
I doubt it. The contrast between rich and poor in his early films doesn't
seem all that radical. One would hardly mistake them for a call to revolution.

I have done some digging and found out that Upton Sinclaur moved to Pasadena
in 1915, and I wouldn't be surprised to lean that Rob Wagner was a friend of
his who might have introduced Chaplin to him. Sinclair was a socialist but not
a pacifist. He supported the Allied cause in WWI because of his distaste for
German authoritariarnism, which he consided medieval.

Chaplin mentions a bit of a conversation he had with Sinclair in Chapter 15 but
doesn't indicate when it occurred.

I will recheck Milton.

Connie K.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

"Arnie Bernstein" (arniebernstein@hotmail.com) writes:
> You might want to check out Tramp: The Life of Charlie Chaplin by
> Joyce Milton, although it does a hatchet job on his politics and
> personal life. Milton is one of the co-authors of the The Rosenberg
> File, which reveals Julius Rosenberg was guilty--albeit this is also
> written up as a hatchet job.
>
> Arnie Bernstein
> www.arniebernstein.com
> www.myspace.com/arniebernstein

I have now checked into it, and she does have some information on
Rob Wagner, most of which comes from the Upton Sinclair papers as far
as I can tell. Documentation isn't her strong point. It seems that Wagner and
Sinclair were very close, which led to Wagner being fired from his job as a
wrestling coach in a public school, or so she says. Wagner was a socialist
like Sinclair, but also a pacifist, which Sinclair was not.

It seems quite likely that Wagner introduced Chaplin to Sinclair someime in
the late teens, and that the picture in _My Autobiography_ is a record of one
of their meetings.

Milton also claims that Chaplin unwisely told an interviewer that he'd like
to take a vacation in Russia, but that was in 1916, and I doubt that such a
statement would have led to a series of questions about bolshevism in 1921,
unless he said it more than once.

On the other hand, if being a friend of Sinclair could get a public school
coach fired, then maybe being a mere acquaintance of Sinclair's could get a
celebrity suspected of bolshevism.

I'm not sure I understand exactly what political climate prevailed at that time.

Connie K.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

On Feb 19, 11:17�pm, d....TakeThisOut@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance Kuriyama)
wrote:
> "Arnie Bernstein" (arniebernst...@hotmail.com) writes:
> > You might want to check out Tramp: The Life of Charlie Chaplin by
> > Joyce Milton, although it does a hatchet job on his politics and
> > personal life.  Milton is one of the co-authors of the The Rosenberg
> > File, which reveals Julius Rosenberg was guilty--albeit this is also
> > written up as a hatchet job.
>
> > Arnie Bernstein
> >www.arniebernstein.com
> >www.myspace.com/arniebernstein
>
> I have now checked into it, and she does have some information on
> Rob Wagner, most of which comes from the Upton Sinclair papers as far
> as I can tell. Documentation isn't her strong point.  It seems that Wagner and
> Sinclair were very close, which led to Wagner being fired from his job as a
> wrestling coach in a public school, or so she says. Wagner was a socialist
> like Sinclair, but also a pacifist, which Sinclair was not.
>
> It seems quite likely that Wagner introduced Chaplin to Sinclair someime in
> the late teens, and that the picture in _My Autobiography_ is a record of one
> of their meetings.
>
> Milton also claims that Chaplin unwisely told an interviewer that he'd like
> to take a vacation in Russia, but that was in 1916, and I doubt that such a
> statement would have led to a series of questions about bolshevism in 1921,
> unless he said it more than once.
>
> On the other hand, if being a friend of Sinclair could get a public school
> coach fired, then maybe being a mere acquaintance of Sinclair's could get a
> celebrity suspected of bolshevism.
>
> I'm not sure I understand exactly what political climate prevailed at that time.
>
> Connie K.

Chaplin wrote in MA that his interest in socialism dated to his
friendship with Upton Sinclair. The two had known each other in 1918,
when Sinclair submitted a never-filmed screenplay to Chaplin, THE
HYPNOTIST.
At some point Sinclair bought a home in Monrovia CA.--about ten
miles east of Pasadena--and lived there until the mid-1960s.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

Constance Kuriyama wrote:

> In _My Trip Abroad_, Chaplin recalls a press conference in
> Chicago in which a reporter asked him, "Are you a Bolshevik?"
> This was of course in late August of 1921
>
> Now how did the reporter get that idea?


Connie, it only now occurs to me that I've got a 1921 issue of
SHADOWLAND, with a Chaplin interview in it. I posted highlights here
in the group a few years ago; do a Google search on that and you'll
see the quotes about Russia and "Lenine."

He mentions that newspaper reporters had been asking him about his
views on Russia, so there may be any number of references in old
papers that have never been republished.

Based on what he says in SHADOWLAND alone, it's no wonder an FBI
file began to be compiled, though he never gets very specific in that
interview about exactly what it was that he admired.



--Shush--
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

On Feb 21, 3:02 pm, d....DeleteThis@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance Kuriyama)
wrote:
> "Richard Carnahan" (rfcsac6...@aol.com) writes:
> > On Feb 19, 11:17=EF=BF=BDpm, d....DeleteThis@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance Kuriyama)
> > wrote:
> >> "Arnie Bernstein" (arniebernst...@hotmail.com) writes:
> >> > You might want to check out Tramp: The Life of Charlie Chaplin by
> >> > Joyce Milton, although it does a hatchet job on his politics and
> >> > personal life. =A0Milton is one of the co-authors of the The Rosenberg
> >> > File, which reveals Julius Rosenberg was guilty--albeit this is also
> >> > written up as a hatchet job.
>
> >> > Arnie Bernstein
> >> >www.arniebernstein.com
> >> >www.myspace.com/arniebernstein
>
> >> I have now checked into it, and she does have some information on
> >> Rob Wagner, most of which comes from the Upton Sinclair papers as far
> >> as I can tell. Documentation isn't her strong point. =A0It seems that Wag=
> > ner and
> >> Sinclair were very close, which led to Wagner being fired from his job as=
> > a
> >> wrestling coach in a public school, or so she says. Wagner was a socialist
> >> like Sinclair, but also a pacifist, which Sinclair was not.
>
> >> It seems quite likely that Wagner introduced Chaplin to Sinclair someime =
> > in
> >> the late teens, and that the picture in _My Autobiography_ is a record of=
> > one
> >> of their meetings.
>
> >> Milton also claims that Chaplin unwisely told an interviewer that he'd li=
> > ke
> >> to take a vacation in Russia, but that was in 1916, and I doubt that such=
> > a
> >> statement would have led to a series of questions about bolshevism in 192=
> > 1,
> >> unless he said it more than once.
>
> >> On the other hand, if being a friend of Sinclair could get a public school
> >> coach fired, then maybe being a mere acquaintance of Sinclair's could get=
> > a
> >> celebrity suspected of bolshevism.
>
> >> I'm not sure I understand exactly what political climate prevailed at tha=
> > t time.
>
> >> Connie K.
>
> > Chaplin wrote in MA that his interest in socialism dated to his
> > friendship with Upton Sinclair.
>
> Right. That's the passage I referred to earlier. He doesn't say when that
> conversation with Sinclair took place.
>
> The two had known each other in 1918,
>
> > when Sinclair submitted a never-filmed screenplay to Chaplin, THE
> > HYPNOTIST.
>
> Didn't know this. I suppose one would find out more about that from a
> bio. of Sinclair. I need to read one, I think.

Sinclair would be fascinating to learn more about, but I think the
key, at least in terms of Chaplin is Wagner.

I did a little digging and found out that a Rob *L.* Wagner wrote a
history of Los Angeles newspapers titled 'Red Ink, White Lies,'
published in 2000 (http://www.amazon.com/Red-Ink-White-Lies-Newspapers/
dp/0944933807). In an interview with the author I found out that
"[a]side from his grandfather's journalism background, Wagner's great-
grandfather (also Rob), was editor and publisher of a literary film
magazine." BINGO!

A little more digging turned up the fact that Rob L. is now overseas,
but I'm hoping contact info will be coming my way soon. With any luck
a really intriguing and informative interview just might be in the
stars. I'll let you all know.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

"Richard Carnahan" (rfcsac627n@aol.com) writes:
> On Feb 19, 11:17=EF=BF=BDpm, d....DeleteThis@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance Kuriyama)
> wrote:
>> "Arnie Bernstein" (arniebernst...@hotmail.com) writes:
>> > You might want to check out Tramp: The Life of Charlie Chaplin by
>> > Joyce Milton, although it does a hatchet job on his politics and
>> > personal life. =A0Milton is one of the co-authors of the The Rosenberg
>> > File, which reveals Julius Rosenberg was guilty--albeit this is also
>> > written up as a hatchet job.
>>
>> > Arnie Bernstein
>> >www.arniebernstein.com
>> >www.myspace.com/arniebernstein
>>
>> I have now checked into it, and she does have some information on
>> Rob Wagner, most of which comes from the Upton Sinclair papers as far
>> as I can tell. Documentation isn't her strong point. =A0It seems that Wag=
> ner and
>> Sinclair were very close, which led to Wagner being fired from his job as=
> a
>> wrestling coach in a public school, or so she says. Wagner was a socialist
>> like Sinclair, but also a pacifist, which Sinclair was not.
>>
>> It seems quite likely that Wagner introduced Chaplin to Sinclair someime =
> in
>> the late teens, and that the picture in _My Autobiography_ is a record of=
> one
>> of their meetings.
>>
>> Milton also claims that Chaplin unwisely told an interviewer that he'd li=
> ke
>> to take a vacation in Russia, but that was in 1916, and I doubt that such=
> a
>> statement would have led to a series of questions about bolshevism in 192=
> 1,
>> unless he said it more than once.
>>
>> On the other hand, if being a friend of Sinclair could get a public school
>> coach fired, then maybe being a mere acquaintance of Sinclair's could get=
> a
>> celebrity suspected of bolshevism.
>>
>> I'm not sure I understand exactly what political climate prevailed at tha=
> t time.
>>
>> Connie K.
>
> Chaplin wrote in MA that his interest in socialism dated to his
> friendship with Upton Sinclair.

Right. That's the passage I referred to earlier. He doesn't say when that
conversation with Sinclair took place.

The two had known each other in 1918,
> when Sinclair submitted a never-filmed screenplay to Chaplin, THE
> HYPNOTIST.

Didn't know this. I suppose one would find out more about that from a
bio. of Sinclair. I need to read one, I think.

Connie K.


> At some point Sinclair bought a home in Monrovia CA.--about ten
> miles east of Pasadena--and lived there until the mid-1960s.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

"Shush" (shushfilmseznospam@yahoo.com) writes:
> Constance Kuriyama wrote:
>
>> In _My Trip Abroad_, Chaplin recalls a press conference in
>> Chicago in which a reporter asked him, "Are you a Bolshevik?"
>> This was of course in late August of 1921
>>
>> Now how did the reporter get that idea?
>
>
> Connie, it only now occurs to me that I've got a 1921 issue of
> SHADOWLAND, with a Chaplin interview in it. I posted highlights here
> in the group a few years ago; do a Google search on that and you'll
> see the quotes about Russia and "Lenine."
>
> He mentions that newspaper reporters had been asking him about his
> views on Russia, so there may be any number of references in old
> papers that have never been republished.
>
> Based on what he says in SHADOWLAND alone, it's no wonder an FBI
> file began to be compiled, though he never gets very specific in that
> interview about exactly what it was that he admired.
>
>
>
> --Shush--
>

There you are at last. I've been waiting for you. ;-)

I do vaguely remember that post now that you mention it. I'll
refresh my memory. How wide a circulation did _Shadowland_ have?
The movie magazine Milton mentions wasnn't one of the better known
ones. But if he was talking about his admiration for Russia off
and on between 1916 and 1921, I suppose word might get around.
However, it was not just in Chicago that he was asked that question in
1921, but in other places as well, which would suggest that some
major news source printed a story that made reference to his views
on Russia. If so, I haven't found it yet.

Connie K.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

"David Totheroh" (dtotheroh@aol.com) writes:
> On Feb 21, 3:02 pm, d....RemoveThis@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance Kuriyama)
> wrote:
>> "Richard Carnahan" (rfcsac6...@aol.com) writes:
>> > On Feb 19, 11:17=EF=BF=BDpm, d....RemoveThis@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance Kuriyama)
>> > wrote:
>> >> "Arnie Bernstein" (arniebernst...@hotmail.com) writes:
>> >> > You might want to check out Tramp: The Life of Charlie Chaplin by
>> >> > Joyce Milton, although it does a hatchet job on his politics and
>> >> > personal life. =A0Milton is one of the co-authors of the The Rosenberg
>> >> > File, which reveals Julius Rosenberg was guilty--albeit this is also
>> >> > written up as a hatchet job.
>>
>> >> > Arnie Bernstein
>> >> >www.arniebernstein.com
>> >> >www.myspace.com/arniebernstein
>>
>> >> I have now checked into it, and she does have some information on
>> >> Rob Wagner, most of which comes from the Upton Sinclair papers as far
>> >> as I can tell. Documentation isn't her strong point. =A0It seems that Wag=
>> > ner and
>> >> Sinclair were very close, which led to Wagner being fired from his job as=
>> > a
>> >> wrestling coach in a public school, or so she says. Wagner was a socialist
>> >> like Sinclair, but also a pacifist, which Sinclair was not.
>>
>> >> It seems quite likely that Wagner introduced Chaplin to Sinclair someime =
>> > in
>> >> the late teens, and that the picture in _My Autobiography_ is a record of=
>> > one
>> >> of their meetings.
>>
>> >> Milton also claims that Chaplin unwisely told an interviewer that he'd li=
>> > ke
>> >> to take a vacation in Russia, but that was in 1916, and I doubt that such=
>> > a
>> >> statement would have led to a series of questions about bolshevism in 192=
>> > 1,
>> >> unless he said it more than once.
>>
>> >> On the other hand, if being a friend of Sinclair could get a public school
>> >> coach fired, then maybe being a mere acquaintance of Sinclair's could get=
>> > a
>> >> celebrity suspected of bolshevism.
>>
>> >> I'm not sure I understand exactly what political climate prevailed at tha=
>> > t time.
>>
>> >> Connie K.
>>
>> > Chaplin wrote in MA that his interest in socialism dated to his
>> > friendship with Upton Sinclair.
>>
>> Right. That's the passage I referred to earlier. He doesn't say when that
>> conversation with Sinclair took place.
>>
>> The two had known each other in 1918,
>>
>> > when Sinclair submitted a never-filmed screenplay to Chaplin, THE
>> > HYPNOTIST.
>>
>> Didn't know this. I suppose one would find out more about that from a
>> bio. of Sinclair. I need to read one, I think.
>
> Sinclair would be fascinating to learn more about, but I think the
> key, at least in terms of Chaplin is Wagner.
>
> I did a little digging and found out that a Rob *L.* Wagner wrote a
> history of Los Angeles newspapers titled 'Red Ink, White Lies,'
> published in 2000 (http://www.amazon.com/Red-Ink-White-Lies-Newspapers/
> dp/0944933807). In an interview with the author I found out that
> "[a]side from his grandfather's journalism background, Wagner's great-
> grandfather (also Rob), was editor and publisher of a literary film
> magazine." BINGO!

According to Milton, Chaplin's Rob was also Rob L. Wagner.

> A little more digging turned up the fact that Rob L. is now overseas,
> but I'm hoping contact info will be coming my way soon. With any luck
> a really intriguing and informative interview just might be in the
> stars. I'll let you all know.

Oh please do. I think we're on the trail of a really important part of
Chaplin's life that hasn't been given much attention.

Before his move to California, Sinclair was also associated with Max
Eastman, who was friendly with Chaplin in the 1920s. It seems to be a
tight little circle.

Connie K.
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism 

Constance Kuriyama wrote:

> I do vaguely remember that post now that you mention it. I'll
> refresh my memory. How wide a circulation did _Shadowland_ have?
> The movie magazine Milton mentions wasnn't one of the better known
> ones.

SHADOWLAND wasn't really a movie magazine; but about contemporary
arts in general: painting, ballet, theatre, photography, etc. It was
probably a little too sophisticated for a general audience, and it
folded after a couple of years. But it may have been widely read by
the artsy "in" crowd.



--Shush--
 >> Stay informed about: Chaplin's Suspected Bolshevism