The Kid

Still, if the kid had no computer interaction from the rebels on the
outside, he might not have been able to build the faith needed for
self-substantiation. Like the Oracle said to Neo, 'would you have knocked it
(vase) over if I didn't tell you...?' Would the kid have self-substantiated
if Neo and Morpheus never communicated to him from outside the matrix?

-Knowledge

"Melloccino" <melloccino.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2kpdsdF4su2gU1@uni-berlin.de...
> I'm not convinced. I see Neo not like a God (I don't think Neo does,
> either), but as someone who realises the evils of idolatry. He
> emphasised the need for Kid to accept truth in the face of false
> belief - that Kid and only Kid can have chosen to *self*-substantiate
> (in other words, a rather svelte commentary on religion). Certainly, Neo
> suggested that when he said "You saved yourself."
>
> Otherwise, I could equally argue that Trinity also 'got him out', since
> she was also aboard the Neb when Kid s/s'ed (that is, apart from the
> information we have when Popper woke up, anything else is inference,
> including the suggestion that Neo had more 'responsibility' than
> Trinity).
>
> Yet another argument (as has been presented before, I believe) could be
> that Neo actually is/was a God, but that he didn't believe in himself,
> while others did (e.g. Kid; Niobe).
>
> At this point I'll also put in a plug for my restaurant's Soup O' The
> Day: Kettle of Fish for $1. I also have Cans of Worms going out for 10
> cents.
> --
> Melloccino
> ----------------------------------------
> "There are truths on this side of the Pyrenees...
> ...that are falsehoods on the other"
>
> Knowledge wrote:
> > He wouldn't have done it if not for Neo.
> >
> > -Knowledge
> >
> > "Logan" <logan1.TakeThisOut@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
> >> just somewhat sadly kid never truly accepted that he did all the work
> >> himself, kind of fixated on neo.. as you all no doubt know :)
> >> "PouchCotato" <pouchcotatoNOSPAM.TakeThisOut@iinet.net.au> wrote in message
> >>> Gavin Smith wrote:
> >>>> Scrumpet wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Is the kid that jumps off the school in Animatrix the same kid
> >>>>> that Neo said "you saved yourself, kid" to in M2? I'm assuming
> >>>>> there is a connection there?
> >>>>
> >>>> Yes. Michael Karl Popper is the kid in the (Ani)Matrix, and the
> >>>> Kid in the real world is the Kid formerly known as Michael Karl
> >>>> Popper, having escaped through self-substantiation, hence Neo's
> >>>> "you saved yourself".
> >>>
> >>> Neo's "you saved yourself" was because the Kid wanted to be free.
> >>> It was his choice, not Neo's.
>
>

Thanks pc. ;-)

-Knowledge

"PouchCotato" <pouchcotatoNOSPAM RemoveThis @iinet.net.au> wrote in message
news:40e7a0e3$0$24742$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> As always, Mello, a wealth of knowledge there...(hah, just realised it was
a
> reply to knowledge...nice :))
>
> I see it as this kind of thing: If I tell someone how to shoot a gun, and
> they go out and kill someone, did I kill that person? We have to be
> responsible for our own actions. I do agree he wouldn't have got out
without
> Neo, but he also wouldn't have got out without Morpheus, Trinity, et. al.
>
> Neo told The Kid that he could be free, The Kid believed him and The Kid
> utilised that knowledge (heheh) to self-substantiate.
> --
> -PouchCotato
>
> Melloccino wrote:
> > I'm not convinced. I see Neo not like a God (I don't think Neo does,
> > either), but as someone who realises the evils of idolatry. He
> > emphasised the need for Kid to accept truth in the face of false
> > belief - that Kid and only Kid can have chosen to *self*-substantiate
> > (in other words, a rather svelte commentary on religion). Certainly,
> > Neo suggested that when he said "You saved yourself."
> >
> > Otherwise, I could equally argue that Trinity also 'got him out',
> > since she was also aboard the Neb when Kid s/s'ed (that is, apart
> > from the information we have when Popper woke up, anything else is
> > inference, including the suggestion that Neo had more
> > 'responsibility' than Trinity).
> >
> > Yet another argument (as has been presented before, I believe) could
> > be that Neo actually is/was a God, but that he didn't believe in
> > himself, while others did (e.g. Kid; Niobe).
> >
> > At this point I'll also put in a plug for my restaurant's Soup O' The
> > Day: Kettle of Fish for $1. I also have Cans of Worms going out for 10
> > cents.
> >
> > Knowledge wrote:
> >> He wouldn't have done it if not for Neo.
> >>
> >> -Knowledge
> >>
> >> "Logan" <logan1 RemoveThis @optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
> >>> just somewhat sadly kid never truly accepted that he did all the
> >>> work himself, kind of fixated on neo.. as you all no doubt know :)
> >>> "PouchCotato" <pouchcotatoNOSPAM RemoveThis @iinet.net.au> wrote in message
> >>>> Gavin Smith wrote:
> >>>>> Scrumpet wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Is the kid that jumps off the school in Animatrix the same kid
> >>>>>> that Neo said "you saved yourself, kid" to in M2? I'm assuming
> >>>>>> there is a connection there?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Yes. Michael Karl Popper is the kid in the (Ani)Matrix, and the
> >>>>> Kid in the real world is the Kid formerly known as Michael Karl
> >>>>> Popper, having escaped through self-substantiation, hence Neo's
> >>>>> "you saved yourself".
> >>>>
> >>>> Neo's "you saved yourself" was because the Kid wanted to be free.
> >>>> It was his choice, not Neo's.
>
>