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Alien "Plot Problem"?

 
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 16) Posted: Sat Feb 05, 2005 2:41 pm
Post subject: Re: Alien "Plot Problem"? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>cult-movies>alien (more info?)

In article <cu0m9u$u1p$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"John Redman" <johnphilipredman RemoveThis @hotmailREMOVETHEBLEEDINOBVIOUS.com> wrote:

> I haven't seen AvP, but if any part of the premise is that the Preds go
> looking for aliens to hunt, that too strongly suggests they are *not* a Pred
> creation. If they were, the Preds wouldn't need to seek aliens out. They
> could just order some off the Pred equivalent of eBay and have them
> delivered to a suitably challenging locale.

Spoilers ahead

..
..
..


AvP has one of those stupid scenes where one of the character looks at some
ancient hieroglyfs in this temple and magically understands and explains the
entire plot; Predators plant Alien eggs with different species. The resulting
aliens is used as an initiation process for young predators in some form of
manhood test. As it is, the ultimate Alien is bred from humans.

Wayland and Co finds and enters this ancient pyramid just as it is being
'activated' (which is why they found it in the first place). And then the
predators arrive.

--
Sandman[.net]

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Hidden Beadwork

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Since: Feb 05, 2005
Posts: 5



(Msg. 17) Posted: Sat Feb 05, 2005 10:59 pm
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In article <36iemsF53do41U1 DeleteThis @individual.net>, "Robert"
<rdbake DeleteThis @NOSPAMprtcnet.org> writes:

>The Pred in the first movie ignores the lone
>female cast member
>because she's unarmed, engages the most dangerous targets he can find,
>prefers to go
>mano a mano with the lone survivor of a dangerous group, etc. It's all in
>there. ;)
>

Some useless info... I think "mano y mano" means "hand and hand" (as in
*unarmed* combat, "hand-to-hand" in English).

"Mano" is 'hand', not 'man'. (I think this is called a "false cognate.")

The Predators rarely (if ever) went "mano y mano" in the movies. And not just
because the Predator isn't strictly a man. :) They used weapons.

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Adam Cameron

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Since: Oct 27, 2005
Posts: 222



(Msg. 18) Posted: Sat Feb 05, 2005 11:11 pm
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> manhood test. As it is, the ultimate Alien is bred from humans.

Again, this assumes that the *only* usage for aliens is for predator sport.
There's nothing to support this.

> Wayland and Co finds and enters this ancient pyramid just as it is being
> 'activated' (which is why they found it in the first place). And then the
> predators arrive.

I see no point here. What do you mean?

--

Adam
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Adam Cameron

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(Msg. 19) Posted: Sat Feb 05, 2005 11:14 pm
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> This predator "theory" merely adds a new layer to that. SJ might for all
> intents and purposes be a species in liaison with the predators to transport
> these weapons to the different species they want to incubate with them - for
> training.
>
> There wouldn't be a problem incorporating the Predators from AvP in the alien
> universe as told in Alien. The question is if there would be a point. I suppose
> that if you like to theorize about aliens, it's all good fun.

I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the two?

--

Adam
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ADWatts

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Since: Feb 09, 2005
Posts: 69



(Msg. 20) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 1:40 am
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Adam Cameron asked:

> I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the two?

There isn't.

Well . . . except to pry money out of wallets, that is.

Have a great day!

Ahmed
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 21) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 1:37 pm
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In article <1rh86r8m0ewg6.r18gclfo3s56$.dlg@40tude.net>, Adam Cameron
<adam_junk DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:

>> This predator "theory" merely adds a new layer to that. SJ might for
>> all intents and purposes be a species in liaison with the predators
>> to transport these weapons to the different species they want to
>> incubate with them - for training.
>>
>> There wouldn't be a problem incorporating the Predators from AvP in
>> the alien universe as told in Alien. The question is if there would
>> be a point. I suppose that if you like to theorize about aliens, it's
>> all good fun.
>
> I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the two?

There would be a need to do -such things- as tying AvP to Alien if one likes to
theorize about the Alien universe - which is just about every person in this
group. Now, not all would choose this particular theory - but the whole alien
lifecycle/bishop droid or human are the same kind of theories.

--
Sandman[.net]
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Adam Cameron

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Since: Oct 27, 2005
Posts: 222



(Msg. 22) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 1:37 pm
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>> I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the two?
>
> There would be a need to do -such things- as tying AvP to Alien if one likes to
> theorize about the Alien universe - which is just about every person in this
> group. Now, not all would choose this particular theory - but the whole alien
> lifecycle/bishop droid or human are the same kind of theories.

Sure. I see AvP as a Predator film which happened to pinch some ideas
(badly, for the most part) from Alien and its sequels. I don't see AvP as
anything to do with Alien.

Each to their own, though.

--

Adam
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 23) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 1:37 pm
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In article <fAeNd.52130$eT5.17767@attbi_s51>,
"ADWatts" <adwatts.RemoveThis@graphic-designer.com> wrote:

> > I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the two?
>
> There isn't.

How arrogant of you.

--
Sandman[.net]
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 24) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 1:42 pm
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In article <d5t7dgru3kj9$.q8ot0mzmetvc.dlg@40tude.net>,
Adam Cameron <adam_junk.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > manhood test. As it is, the ultimate Alien is bred from humans.
>
> Again, this assumes that the *only* usage for aliens is for predator sport.

....in this manhood test. That's all it suggests. Alien might be domesticated
pets for Predators, but when born from humans (and other species) they become
killer machines. Who knows?

> There's nothing to support this.

There is nothing that support your assumption either.

> > Wayland and Co finds and enters this ancient pyramid just as it is being
> > 'activated' (which is why they found it in the first place). And then the
> > predators arrive.
>
> I see no point here. What do you mean?

There wasn't any point. The Predators "activate" the pyramid for the manhood
test, which is embedded hundreds of feet below the ice in antartica. Wayland
Yutani sees this in satellite scans (i.e. heat emerging from the ice or
something). They go there and arrive mere hours before the Predators do, just
in time for some to be impregnated by alien eggs in a sacrificial chamber.

--
Sandman[.net]
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Robert

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Since: Feb 03, 2005
Posts: 21



(Msg. 25) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 2:10 pm
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"Sandman" <mr.DeleteThis@sandman.net> wrote

> There wasn't any point. The Predators "activate" the pyramid for the
> manhood
> test, which is embedded hundreds of feet below the ice in antartica.

Whoa, hold on. I didn't see this movie, but I've seen the first two.
It's canon from 1 and 2
that the Preds do not like cold weather - in fact, they only come to earth
to hunt during the extremest
of the extreme of a heat wave, and even _then_ need to wear protective
suits. How/why would/could they
build something in Antartica?
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Covenant

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Since: Jun 28, 2003
Posts: 405



(Msg. 26) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 5:23 pm
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"Adam Cameron" <adam_junk.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1rh86r8m0ewg6.r18gclfo3s56$.dlg@40tude.net...
> > This predator "theory" merely adds a new layer to that. SJ might for all
> > intents and purposes be a species in liaison with the predators to
transport
> > these weapons to the different species they want to incubate with them -
for
> > training.
> >
> > There wouldn't be a problem incorporating the Predators from AvP in the
alien
> > universe as told in Alien. The question is if there would be a point. I
suppose
> > that if you like to theorize about aliens, it's all good fun.
>
> I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the two?


There was no real *need* to do so....

It was kinda a good idea slotted into Predator (The alien *skull* inside the
ship).
Apparently thats where the whole idea came from... A one-off *in* joke.

Not a *bad* idea. But it's what is being done with it that is screwing it.
(Although, if AvP was the goreferst it *should* have been, I wonder if we'd
even be having this kind of conversation !??)


--
Covenant
A Man With Far Too Much Time On His Hands
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Covenant

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Since: Jun 28, 2003
Posts: 405



(Msg. 27) Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 8:11 pm
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"Robert" <rdbake DeleteThis @NOSPAMprtcnet.org> wrote in message
news:36n8dgF5490dbU1@individual.net...


> Whoa, hold on. I didn't see this movie, but I've seen the first
two.
> It's canon from 1 and 2
> that the Preds do not like cold weather - in fact, they only come to earth
> to hunt during the extremest
> of the extreme of a heat wave, and even _then_ need to wear protective
> suits. How/why would/could they
> build something in Antartica?



;' )

Amazing the things they think we won't notice, huh?

(Unless it's *like the goddam tropics* inside the pyramid.)

;' )


--
Covenant
A Man With Far Too Much Time On His Hands
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 28) Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:14 am
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In article <116mo0h817kdp.1c75j57sot50p.dlg DeleteThis @40tude.net>, Adam Cameron
<adam_junk DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:

>>> I still question whether there's any need *at all* to connect the
>>> two?
>>
>> There would be a need to do -such things- as tying AvP to Alien if
>> one likes to theorize about the Alien universe - which is just about
>> every person in this group. Now, not all would choose this particular
>> theory - but the whole alien lifecycle/bishop droid or human are the
>> same kind of theories.
>
> Sure. I see AvP as a Predator film which happened to pinch some ideas
> (badly, for the most part) from Alien and its sequels. I don't see
> AvP as anything to do with Alien.

Oh, I was under the impression that you hadn't even seen the film. My
bad.

--
Sandman[.net]
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 29) Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:15 am
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In article <36n8dgF5490dbU1.DeleteThis@individual.net>, "Robert"
<rdbake.DeleteThis@NOSPAMprtcnet.org> wrote:

>> There wasn't any point. The Predators "activate" the pyramid for the
>> manhood test, which is embedded hundreds of feet below the ice in
>> antartica.
>
> Whoa, hold on. I didn't see this movie, but I've seen the first two.
> It's canon from 1 and 2 that the Preds do not like cold weather - in
> fact, they only come to earth to hunt during the extremest of the
> extreme of a heat wave, and even _then_ need to wear protective suits.
> How/why would/could they build something in Antartica?

I suppose they wouldn't. But hey, inconsistencies hasn't stopped people before.
:)

--
Sandman[.net]
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Sandman

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Since: Oct 15, 2004
Posts: 729



(Msg. 30) Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:16 am
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In article <cu5tl0$m3v$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"Covenant" <covenant.DeleteThis@joelamb.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> > It's canon from 1 and 2
> > that the Preds do not like cold weather - in fact, they only come to earth
> > to hunt during the extremest
> > of the extreme of a heat wave, and even _then_ need to wear protective
> > suits. How/why would/could they
> > build something in Antartica?
>
> Amazing the things they think we won't notice, huh?

Yeah, it's a conspiracy, for sure.

> (Unless it's *like the goddam tropics* inside the pyramid.)

Irrelevant, the final fight takes place on the snow, as does the first.

--
Sandman[.net]
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