Sanken CUB-01

On Nov 6, 7:55 am, "oleg kaizerman" <kaize....TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2 would be better to cower the head pans oposit to the mic( pwrson who looks
> and talks to the window )
>
> <audio....TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
>
> news:1194362661.454682.308950@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com wrote:
> >> When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> >> need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> >> generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> > One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> > could cause phasing problems.
>
> > Eric

I am working on a show with about 8-10 pages of car interior on each
episode. I bought 2 Schoeps BLM mics and I use 1 in the front and 1
in the back. That covers all 4 people in the car. Sometimes we get a
5th person and this week they even threw in a sheep in the backseat
(don't ask). So far so good. We've done 13 episodes and they haven't
had to ADR any lines from any of our int. car scenes.
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

2 would be better to cower the head pans oposit to the mic( pwrson who looks
and talks to the window )

<audioetc.TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:1194362661.454682.308950@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com wrote:
>> When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
>> need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
>> generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> could cause phasing problems.
>
>
> Eric
>
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 6, 8:19 am, Jon Ailetcher <jami... RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 6, 7:55 am, "oleg kaizerman" <kaize... RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > 2 would be better to cower the head pans oposit to the mic( pwrson who looks
> > and talks to the window )
>
> > <audio... RemoveThis @bellsouth.net> wrote in message
>
> >news:1194362661.454682.308950@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi... RemoveThis @hotmail.com wrote:
> > >> When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> > >> need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> > >> generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> > > One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> > > could cause phasing problems.
>
> > > Eric
>
> I am working on a show with about 8-10 pages of car interior on each
> episode. I bought 2 Schoeps BLM mics and I use 1 in the front and 1
> in the back. That covers all 4 people in the car. Sometimes we get a
> 5th person and this week they even threw in a sheep in the backseat
> (don't ask). So far so good. We've done 13 episodes and they haven't
> had to ADR any lines from any of our int. car scenes.

one works fine if the actors don't turn their heads and speak out the
windows, away from the mic.
I've had good luck w/ two in the front seat as well, esp. in cars with
a ceiling console that separates the mics.
As will call such rigs you are totally at the mercy of the noise the
car makes, wind and road noise
if the windows are down and trailer and lighting equipment rattle if
on a trailer or tow rig.

Philip Perkins
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 6, 8:19 am, Jon Ailetcher <jami... RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 6, 7:55 am, "oleg kaizerman" <kaize... RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > 2 would be better to cower the head pans oposit to the mic( pwrson who looks
> > and talks to the window )
>
> > <audio... RemoveThis @bellsouth.net> wrote in message
>
> >news:1194362661.454682.308950@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi... RemoveThis @hotmail.com wrote:
> > >> When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> > >> need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> > >> generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> > > One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> > > could cause phasing problems.
>
> > > Eric
>
> I am working on a show with about 8-10 pages of car interior on each
> episode. I bought 2 Schoeps BLM mics and I use 1 in the front and 1
> in the back. That covers all 4 people in the car. Sometimes we get a
> 5th person and this week they even threw in a sheep in the backseat
> (don't ask). So far so good. We've done 13 episodes and they haven't
> had to ADR any lines from any of our int. car scenes.

Jon,

A further question to your experience: Are your vehicle scenes on a
precess trailer of are they actor drive? Windows up or down. Obviously
not a convertible with the top down?!

Also, the BLM, are they susceptible to low freq vibration with the
vehicle in motion. I assume they have some low rumbles but not as much
as the CMC41 because they are omni capsules. IE. are they ok with a
wireless hookup in vehicles?

Eric Lamontagne
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 6, 7:24 am, audio... DeleteThis @bellsouth.net wrote:
> On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi... DeleteThis @hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> > need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> > generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> could cause phasing problems.
>
> Eric

Eric,

The "phasing problems" of two mics would be at very minimal impact as
the distances to each actor remain very predictable. A good mix should
resolve any noticable artifacts. Far easier than mixing a boom and a
wire in the same scene, in my opinion.

Also, I would use only one mic for a front two shot, head turns
falling away would seem more natural from this perspective. However, I
might be more inclined to go with two mics for a door mounted side
shot holding two characters for example. The problem I often have in
cars is one character is often louder or softer than the other due to
positioning or performance. This would also be resolved with two mics.

Anyone ever tried a figure eight pattern schoeps mic mounted with a
collette cable on the CMC or just the CCM onto a BLCg (http://
www.schoeps.de/E-2004/boundary-layer-direc.html#blc). This would be
"decoded" to a stereo recording with one character on left and one
character on right. You would have the benefit of the boundary
technique (possible 6db gain) with directional characteristics of two
cardioids (cut in half due to the boundary, so closter to a hypercard
patern) on each sphere or side. In theory this sounds ideal.....anyone
try it?

Good Luck!

Eric Lamontagne
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 7, 10:01 am, acmeso....RemoveThis@gmail.com wrote:
> On Nov 6, 7:24 am, audio....RemoveThis@bellsouth.net wrote:
>
> > On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi....RemoveThis@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > > When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> > > need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> > > generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> > One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> > could cause phasing problems.
>
> > Eric
>
> Eric,
>
> The "phasing problems" of two mics would be at very minimal impact as
> the distances to each actor remain very predictable. A good mix should
> resolve any noticable artifacts. Far easier than mixing a boom and a
> wire in the same scene, in my opinion.
>
> Also, I would use only one mic for a front two shot, head turns
> falling away would seem more natural from this perspective. However, I
> might be more inclined to go with two mics for a door mounted side
> shot holding two characters for example. The problem I often have in
> cars is one character is often louder or softer than the other due to
> positioning or performance. This would also be resolved with two mics.
>
> Anyone ever tried a figure eight pattern schoeps mic mounted with a
> collette cable on the CMC or just the CCM onto a BLCg (http://www.schoeps.de/E-2004/boundary-layer-direc.html#blc). This would be
> "decoded" to a stereo recording with one character on left and one
> character on right. You would have the benefit of the boundary
> technique (possible 6db gain) with directional characteristics of two
> cardioids (cut in half due to the boundary, so closter to a hypercard
> patern) on each sphere or side. In theory this sounds ideal.....anyone
> try it?
>
> Good Luck!
>
> Eric Lamontagne

Here is an electret (similar to the CUB) condenser boundary mic with a
continuously variable polar patern. Omni to Card to figure 8. Anyone
try this? At this price point it's disposable!
http://mixonline.com/mixline_live/Astatic-930-VP-0920046/

Any mic with an LED has got to be the best!!

Eric Lamontagne
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 6, 10:24 am, audio....DeleteThis@bellsouth.net wrote:
> On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi....DeleteThis@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> > need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> > generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> could cause phasing problems.
>
> Eric

I disagree...I find that this mic has to be pretty close in order to
get a rich sound. Also, if you put it in the center and one or both
of the actors delivers lines looking out the window, you're f---ed.
The CUB doesn't have a long enough throw to cause any real phasing
threat from across the car -- unless they're screaming, at which point
you can probably play it off of one anyway.

..02 nvt
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 7, 12:19 am, Philip Perkins <spami....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:

> As will call such rigs you are totally at the mercy of the noise the
> car makes, wind and road noise
> if the windows are down and trailer and lighting equipment rattle if
> on a trailer or tow rig.

Well, one or the other but not both (ie process trailer noise or car
self-noise). Lighting equipment rattle can be tempered some with a
patient gaffer, so it helps to be friendly with that person. Usually
what's making noise is unsecured lenses (which can be shimmed if done
carefully) or rattling barn doors (which can be secured). Grips can
also be a world of help (if you can get them to play on your team)
with noisy arms, gels, etc.

It also may salve your conscience some to remember that when there's a
big noisy rattle over a bumpy stretch of road, usually the camera
shakes too and it ends up not being used.

nvt
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 7, 1:01 pm, acmeso....TakeThisOut@gmail.com wrote:

> Anyone ever tried a figure eight pattern schoeps mic mounted with a
> collette cable on the CMC or just the CCM onto a BLCg (http://www.schoeps.de/E-2004/boundary-layer-direc.html#blc).

No, but I have simply put the MK-8 capsule in between the driver and
passenger before with fine success. Again, it doesn' t work for those
pensive moments when the actors stare longingly out the window, and
the pickup pattern of the microphone stares longingly at the back of
the actor's head.

BTW, as for LF rumble with BLMs -- try using the CUT-1 filter on the
preamp end to get rid of this. I have used them with a wireless rig
many times (Audio Ltd.) without issue.

nvt
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 7, 12:36 pm, Noah Timan <dontwritemeher....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Nov 7, 1:01 pm, acmeso....TakeThisOut@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > Anyone ever tried a figure eight pattern schoeps mic mounted with a
> > collette cable on the CMC or just the CCM onto a BLCg (http://www.schoeps.de/E-2004/boundary-layer-direc.html#blc).
>
> No, but I have simply put the MK-8 capsule in between the driver and
> passenger before with fine success. Again, it doesn' t work for those
> pensive moments when the actors stare longingly out the window, and
> the pickup pattern of the microphone stares longingly at the back of
> the actor's head.
>
> BTW, as for LF rumble with BLMs -- try using the CUT-1 filter on the
> preamp end to get rid of this. I have used them with a wireless rig
> many times (Audio Ltd.) without issue.
>
> nvt

I use my BLM's with a Lectro 400 wireless rig. I got some really bad
line noise hardwiring the mics. We've tried different cables but that
doesn't seem to help. Only using wireless works. As far as LF rumble,
almost all our car work is on green screen. We've only done a little
bit of actual driving. When we do though, I just use a low cut and
that does the trick.
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01 

On Nov 7, 3:13 pm, Noah Timan <dontwritemeher... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Nov 6, 10:24 am, audio... DeleteThis @bellsouth.net wrote:
>
> > On Nov 6, 9:44 am, momcilovi... DeleteThis @hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > > When using these mics for two people sat up front in a car, do you
> > > need one over each person, or will one positioned between them
> > > generally be enough to get coverage?
>
> > One placed midway between the actors usually works very well. Two
> > could cause phasing problems.
>
> > Eric
>
> I disagree...I find that this mic has to be pretty close in order to
> get a rich sound. Also, if you put it in the center and one or both
> of the actors delivers lines looking out the window, you're f---ed.
> The CUB doesn't have a long enough throw to cause any real phasing
> threat from across the car -- unless they're screaming, at which point
> you can probably play it off of one anyway.
>
> .02 nvt

+1 Noah,

I always end up using two of these up front, the drop off is really
harsh on these as you had mentioned. If you are in a bigger car or SUV
there is no real way that one will no the job. It is a rare day that
we do not move these around from set up to set up.
 >> Stay informed about: Sanken CUB-01