The Sulaco and other questions

In article <bu7gkp$3p1$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>,
"Covenant" <covenant.TakeThisOut@joelamb.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> > Surveyed ‚ Popularized by military force.
>
> But it is as easy to assume there *is* a force on any of those 300 plus,
> than there than to assume there *isn;t*.

Extrapolate that please. If you were washed up on an empty island in the middle
of the pacific ocean and you know US military would pick you up after 17 days,
would you assume that help would come from the US or from any of the other 300
surveyed empty islands?

> Occams razor don;t cut it for this one.

Occhams razor always cuts it. :P

And what's with the ";"'s instead of "'"'s ?

--
Sandman[.net]
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions 

"Sandman" <mr DeleteThis @sandman.net> wrote in message
news:mr-23D91B.17122617012004@news.fu-berlin.de...
> In article <bu7gkp$3p1$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> "Covenant" <covenant DeleteThis @joelamb.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > > Surveyed ‚ Popularized by military force.
> >
> > But it is as easy to assume there *is* a force on any of those 300 plus,
> > than there than to assume there *isn;t*.
>
> Extrapolate that please. If you were washed up on an empty island in the
middle
> of the pacific ocean and you know US military would pick you up after 17
days,
> would you assume that help would come from the US or from any of the other
300
> surveyed empty islands?

The thing being that we don;t know if any of the 300 are empty.
Also, we dunno if Thadus or Arcturus or the Solomons are closer to LV 426
than the Earth is.
(Remembering that it was gonna take the Nostromo 10 months to get to
*Earth*.)


> And what's with the ";"'s instead of "'"'s ?


It's one typo I can never quite rid myself of.

I dunno why exactly, but I always feel I am over reaching to do a ' so I
subconciously pull in and do a ; instead.

One of the mysteries of the universe!!
;' )

--
Covenant
A Man With Far Too Much Time On His Hands
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions 

In article <bubv4c$4u3$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>, "Covenant"
<covenant RemoveThis @joelamb.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

>>>> Surveyed ‚ Popularized by military force.
>>>
>>> But it is as easy to assume there *is* a force on any of those 300
>>> plus, than there than to assume there *isn;t*.
>>
>> Extrapolate that please. If you were washed up on an empty island in
>> the middle of the pacific ocean and you know US military would pick
>> you up after 17 days, would you assume that help would come from the
>> US or from any of the other 300 surveyed empty islands?
>
> The thing being that we don;t know if any of the 300 are empty.

Fine, 50 of those islands are populated by american colonists and scientists.
Do you still expect that the US army was based on any, or all of them? Oh, and
in this hypothesis, there are no foreign contries to the US who could "invade"
those islands, at least not as far as the US knows.

> Also,
> we dunno if Thadus or Arcturus or the Solomons are closer to LV 426
> than the Earth is. Remembering that it was gonna take the Nostromo 10
> months to get to *Earth*.

Yes, we've been over that, apparently the Sulaco travels alot faster than the
tug boat Nostromo.

>> And what's with the ";"'s instead of "'"'s ?
>
> It's one typo I can never quite rid myself of.

Ah, I thought it was some secret thing I didn't know anything about.

> I dunno why exactly, but I always feel I am over reaching to do a ' so
> I subconciously pull in and do a ; instead.
>
> One of the mysteries of the universe!!

:P

--
Sandman[.net]
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions 

I must admit that I did not think I would get the number of responses
nor did I expect to create a nice discussion. So, to those of you who
replied, thank you. Now for my follow up questins.

I think we can all agree that the Sulaco was a huge ship. Granted, a
decent portion was dedicated to the hangar. However, Doc and others
have a point. You would have to have some sort of crew on board the
big ship. Even a small crew of 6-10, ala Alien to handle the ship and
the voyage. The Navy now runs the ships the Marines leave from. Yes,
I may be digging too deep, but it is just one of those thigs that has
bugged me.

Also, Burke was most likely in the control room with Hicks before he
left to infect Ripley and Newt. Then he had to leave and go to the
med lab. Didn't he have to pass Vasquez and Hudson in the hallway?
At that point of the movie noone trusted him anyway, so why wouldn't
they question him?

Now, again to the 17 day thing and Alien 3. They arrived pretty quick
when they found out she had one in her. That leads me to think they
were never too far away. Someone said we do not know how long she was
on that planet. I think we do. I think she was only there a couple
of days tops. What I wonder is how far the Sulaco had traveled before
the fire and how far the planet was from Earth or wherever the rescue
would come from.

-Adam


> > Everytime I watch Aliens and the other movies, I am left with a couple
> > of questions.
> >
> > First, where the Colonial Marines and the others the only ones aboard
> > the Sulaco? It always seemed to me it was a huge ship that would need
> > a crew, aside from the infantry.
>
> I would say that the Sulaco is about the same size as a modern mid-range
> container ship. Which makes me ask the very same question: Where is the
> crew? Automation or no, machines do break down. And when they break down
> they need somebody to fix them. While you might be ableto program an android
> with the needed information for this, I seriously doubt that you could teach
> marines.Nothing against leathernecks, but cross-training people for ground
> combat *and* ship maintenance is difficult. It would be like training you to
> build a NASA launchpad *and* the shuttle to go on it. And let's not forget
> that at least one book has the Sulaco carrying multiple weapons. Big ones.
> Pretty hard to teach a guy to do all those things *and* be a ground combat
> specialist.
>
> So yes, there would definitely have to be a crew on a ship that large. Of
> course, the other answer is that this is just a movie. Enjoy it. Savor it.
> Don't overanalyze it.
>
> You wouldn't cut a ribeye steak into hamburger, would you?
>
> Doc
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions 

On 19 Jan 2004 14:33:42 -0800, adam RemoveThis @levenson.org (Damus) wrote:

>I must admit that I did not think I would get the number of responses
>nor did I expect to create a nice discussion. So, to those of you who
>replied, thank you. Now for my follow up questins.
>
>I think we can all agree that the Sulaco was a huge ship. Granted, a
>decent portion was dedicated to the hangar. However, Doc and others
>have a point. You would have to have some sort of crew on board the
>big ship. Even a small crew of 6-10, ala Alien to handle the ship and
>the voyage. The Navy now runs the ships the Marines leave from. Yes,
>I may be digging too deep, but it is just one of those thigs that has
>bugged me.

Bishop can fix the ship
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions 

Everytime I watch Aliens and the other movies, I am left with a couple
of questions.

First, where the Colonial Marines and the others the only ones aboard
the Sulaco? It always seemed to me it was a huge ship that would need
a crew, aside from the infantry.

The Nostromo from Alien only had a small crew which were in cryo sleep most
of the trip and of this crew only 2 were maintinance, so it would be safe to
assume bishop would of handled any maintinace on the Sulaco, also there were
techies in the group (Hudson at least).



Second, where would the rescue in 17 days come from? Earth?
-See bottom

Third, at the beginning of Alien3, is the Sulaco destroyed?
Considering not even a fire is shown, the Sulaco destroyed or even just
unusable is unlikely, the face hugger injures itself trying to open the
cryotube, bleeds acid onto wiring, this gives off smoke, this is inturn
detected by the smoke alarms, computer running on auto says fire, evacuates
crew automatically even though just smoke and no fire.


Fourth, if there was a ship so close to Fury, why didn't it come
rescue Ripley earlier? Surely that ship would have heard of the
distress the Sulaco encountered.
Weyland Yutani (sp?) possibly didnt want her rescued earlier, it wanted the
embryo to grow to a good stage before picking her up, not realising another
alien was loose, also distance of Fiori 169 (sp?) from Earth was never
disclosed it may of been smallish (as space travell goes)


Oh, also in Aliens, how did Burke accomplish the release of the
huggers so quickly?
Safe to Assume Stasis tanks the face huggers were in were computer
controlled therefore could of been programmed release (as simple as powering
the down?, although burke did go into the room Ripley was in to take the M41
Pulse Rifle (before the face huggers were release i assume), while burke may
of been given a level of distrust from Ripley, i dont think the others were
alerted to this or why (remember he did stop Lt. Gorman (sp?) from stopping
ripley rescue the others in the personel carrier (APC)).


How could RIpley know that Burke would stay awake
to sacrifice the crew to bring home the specimen. Surely the
cryo-chambers were computer controlled.
As said by some earlier, as a companyman he would of had access to the
company/marines computers
As a side note in the book when Ripley goes in to rescue Newt she comes
across a semi-conscious burke and gives him a grenade to blow him self up
with (he had already been impregnated from memory)


Bishop II !!! (Check the credits!), check the credits from aliens and the
computer cryo readouts (when they wake upon the Sulaco), the actors first
names (except for a few, bishop, ripley etc) are used as their characters
first names as well), this just shows a lack of originality to me, take into
account when Bishop II was hit on the he had RED BLOOD, now original Bishop
and Ash (android from the first movie) both had white "blood" now suddenly
androids have red? possible but unlikely. I always assumed it was the Real
human Bishop (as claimed in the movie - cant remember what the book said
about it sorry) who would of most likely been working on earth (or near
there)
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions 

"Katchan" <katchan.TakeThisOut@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:UawQb.26163$Wa.14574@news-server.bigpond.net.au...


> First, where the Colonial Marines and the others the only ones aboard
> the Sulaco?

Apparently so.

>It always seemed to me it was a huge ship that would need
> a crew, aside from the infantry.

It *would* seem that way wouldn't it!
And then for *everyone* to leave it to go planetside! Odd, to say the least!
;' )

> The Nostromo from Alien only had a small crew which were in cryo sleep
most
> of the trip and of this crew only 2 were maintinance, so it would be safe
to
> assume bishop would of handled any maintinace on the Sulaco, also there
were
> techies in the group (Hudson at least).

But the Nostromo seemed MUCh smaller than the Nostromo. And at least the
nostromo were an actual flight crew, not just soldiers.


> Second, where would the rescue in 17 days come from? Earth?
> -See bottom


In a nutshell.
We don't know.

(We just talked about this last week!! ;' ) )

> Third, at the beginning of Alien3, is the Sulaco destroyed?

We don't *see* it being destroyed. But apparently we are supposed to believe
it has.

> Considering not even a fire is shown, the Sulaco destroyed or even just
> unusable is unlikely, the face hugger injures itself trying to open the
> cryotube, bleeds acid onto wiring, this gives off smoke, this is inturn
> detected by the smoke alarms, computer running on auto says fire,
evacuates
> crew automatically even though just smoke and no fire.

Crap, ain't it!
;' )

> Fourth, if there was a ship so close to Fury, why didn't it come
> rescue Ripley earlier? Surely that ship would have heard of the
> distress the Sulaco encountered.

Maybe it did.
Maybe it was already on route.


> Oh, also in Aliens, how did Burke accomplish the release of the
> huggers so quickly?

>>ahem<<

Eeeeeevvviiiiiillllll Bishooooppppp !!!!!

;' )


> As a side note in the book when Ripley goes in to rescue Newt she comes
> across a semi-conscious burke and gives him a grenade to blow him self up
> with (he had already been impregnated from memory)

This was actually filmed.
(There are production stills of it.)


> Bishop II !!! (Check the credits!), check the credits from aliens and the
> computer cryo readouts (when they wake upon the Sulaco), the actors first
> names (except for a few, bishop, ripley etc) are used as their characters
> first names as well), this just shows a lack of originality to me,


Why? It is *wholly* original.
(LOOK GUYS !!!! I'M STICKING UP FOR JIMMY C. !!!!! ;' )

How many *other* films do you know that have appx 90% of the cast having the
same name as their characters?
It was both original, AND a nod to the teamwork of the cast... An added
bonus, as it were.


> take into
> account when Bishop II was hit on the he had RED BLOOD, now original
Bishop
> and Ash (android from the first movie) both had white "blood" now suddenly
> androids have red?


Thus, Bishop II... A better model.


> possible but unlikely. I always assumed it was the Real
> human Bishop (as claimed in the movie -

Only by *him*.

;' )

Regarding the whole Bishop thing.....

I don;t *really* believe in Eeeevviiilll Bisshooooppp !!! BUT I also don;t
think it is not a valid theory.
There are descrepancies enough to suggest it, so as a theory, I don;t
condemn it.


Regarding Bishop II

Said, it before, say it again.... NO human could take a blow like he does,
with that amount of damage to the side of the head (his ear and part of his
skull are hanging OFF) and stand and have a conversation with Ripley. And in
the cinematic release the lines "(Damned?) droid!!" (As he was hit) and him
screaming, "I AM NOT AN ANDROID !" were cut!

Now that doesn't neccesarilly mean we really ARE meant to think of him as a
droid.


I just think that the evidence we are presented with falls more towards him
being a droid;

The damage,
The instant recovery,
No sign of pain,
Tiny amount of *blood*
and his creditation as Bishop II (If it was the creator of Bishop he
WOULDN'T be Bishop II at all... He'd be Bishop 0 if anything !!! ;' ) )



....than him Being human;

A tiny amount of red fluid.



;' )


--
Covenant
A Man With Far Too Much Time On His Hands
 >> Stay informed about: The Sulaco and other questions