Sennett on Langdon v. Chaplin (1928) and a Couple of Theor..

David B. Pearson wrote:

> Capra became a great director well after he worked for Langdon.
> Capra became a master propagandist BEFORE he started making
> his pitch to film people like Agee, Brownlow, Kerr and anyone else
> willing to hear it.

Capra made the "Why We Fight" films 15 years after he stopped working
for Langdon.

Once again, your logic is faulty:

1) Capra became a great director only after working for Langdon, so
that fact is inadmissible in any discussion of the merits of Capra's
input on Langdon's films. The fact that "The Strong Man" is Langdon's
best film and Capra directed it is somehow not relevant.

2) Capra made the "Why We Fight" films 15 years after working for
Langdon, but that is somehow relevant.

And Capra did not "make his pitch" to anyone. People came to him for
his opinion on Langdon and he gave it to them. You seem to imply that
he was running around bad-mouthing him to anyone who would listen.

The facts (as opposed to your hard-breathing fantasies) suggest
otherwise.

Tom Moran

Feuillade wrote:
> David B. Pearson wrote:
>
> > Capra became a great director well after he worked for Langdon.
> > Capra became a master propagandist BEFORE he started making
> > his pitch to film people like Agee, Brownlow, Kerr and anyone else
> > willing to hear it.
>
> Capra made the "Why We Fight" films 15 years after he stopped working
> for Langdon.

So?
He talked to Agee in 1949, Brownlow in the 1960s and 70s, and Kerr in
the 1970s, plus who knows who else. All post-date Capra's propaganda
stint for the Army.

> Once again, your logic is faulty:
>
> 1) Capra became a great director only after working for Langdon, so
> that fact is inadmissible in any discussion of the merits of Capra's
> input on Langdon's films. The fact that "The Strong Man" is Langdon's
> best film and Capra directed it is somehow not relevant.

Not at all. "The Strong Man" is certainly ONE of Langdon's best films,
and Capra directed it. That is the linch-pin of Capra's entire case,
and I will quickly concede that yes "The Strong Man" shows Capra had
promising talent as a film director. "Long Pants," on the other hand,
would have gotten anybody tossed into the street!

However, what you didn't mention is Capra's OTHER Langdon credits.
Funny how Capra's defenders speak so little about what the facts
actually show.

According to the film credits -- how many short comedies did Harry
Landgon make for Mack Sennett?

Twenty-one. Or Twenty-three, if we count the two earlier shorts
Langdon made elsewhere, and were grandfathered in via Pathe.

How many of these shorts credit Frank Capra as a member of the Langdon
"creative team?"

Six: "Plain Clothes," "Lucky Stars," "There He Goes," "Saturday
Afternoon," "Fiddlesticks," and "Soldierman." In each case, Capra's
credit is listed beneath co-writer Arthur Ripley. Ripley is credited on
the final nine Langdon shorts, starting with "Boobs in the Woods,"
thereby predating Capra first appearence by at least two months.
Further, during Capra's writing stint with Langdon, he was replaced for
one film, "Remember When?" by Clyde Bruckman.

We also know that, of these twenty one Sennett shorts, Harry Edwards
directed fourteen of them. Edwards also directed Langdon's first two
features: "His First Flame" and "Tramp, Tramp, Tramp."

How many of Langdon's films did Frank Capra direct? Two. One got
excellent reviews, and dubious boxoffice profits. The other one got
Capra fired.

But let's look more at the known facts about these short films -- the
films that established Langdon as important enough a comedy star to be
advanced into features. Twenty-one shorts, and Capra worked on six of
them. Of those six shorts, three of them -- "Saturday Afternoon,"
"Fiddlesticks," and "Soldierman" -- were not released until AFTER
Langdon had moved into independant production at First National.

That reduces the number of Sennett shorts the public would have seen,
prior to Langdon's move -- to eighteen -- and Capra is only known to
have worked on THREE of them. And although it is true it did take
several films before Sennett found the proper settings for Langdon's
stage character -- a simple review of titles like "His New Mama," and
"His Marriage Wow" hammers home the fact that Langdon's style of comedy
was well established before Capra came on the scene.

The credits clearly show that If anyone has a right to claim credit for
Langdon's success -- it is Harry Edwards, who directed most of the
Langdon films. Arthur Ripley, the senior writer, would be third in the
pecking order, and Capra -- being VERY LATE in joining the Langdon team
-- is left in a very poor fourth. Capra's postion is one that appears
interchangable with that of a Clyde Bruckman, the very man he was
interchanged with! That is not a bad position to have -- but light
years away from what Capra claimed. It is also a position far weaker
that Leo McCarey could have claimed on the Laurel and Hardy silents --
and McCarey would not have dared to make the outragous claims Capra
did.

Furthermore, the film credits CLEARLY establish the FACT that Frank
Capra LIED in "The Name Above the Title" in order to give himself more
credit than he deserved. If you have a copy of the book, I suggest you
read the photo caption on page 74.

It says "Co-directors Frank Capra and Harry Edwards, Harry Langdon, and
the ingenue and the prop man all strain for a funny gag in Langdon's
first feature film -- Tramp, Tramp, Tramp."

The credits on "Tramp, Tramp, Tramp" show Harry Edwards was the sole
director of the film.
Tom, I challenge you to show any physical evidence otherwise.

Frank Capra lied. Worse... the cold hard physical evidence suggests he
lied quite a bit. In fact, the more one examines the facts, the biggger
Capra lies appear. The only REAL question is trying to figure out
exactly how big a liar Frank Capra actually was.

> 2) Capra made the "Why We Fight" films 15 years after working for
> Langdon, but that is somehow relevant.

See above.

> And Capra did not "make his pitch" to anyone. People came to him for
> his opinion on Langdon and he gave it to them. You seem to imply that
> he was running around bad-mouthing him to anyone who would listen.

It seems that was the case, at least early on. Capra was pissed! And
after 20 years, Capra could easily have had a well rehearsed line of
bull. Read McBride for the details.

> The facts (as opposed to your hard-breathing fantasies) suggest
> otherwise.
>
> Tom Moran

The facts show that Capra was a fired employee who never got over it.
Later in life, when he got the chance, he twisted reality to fit his
own ego, and stuck an laughable number of daggers into his former boss.
The rage and crocodile "pity" tears are NOW more than obvious.

It seems pretty clear who the "Fathead" really was!

DBP